<HTML><BODY style="word-wrap: break-word; -khtml-nbsp-mode: space; -khtml-line-break: after-white-space; "><BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">-1</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">global sign-out has many issues -- with SXIP 1.0 we had it, and it </DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">was actually irritating, you want to logout of site, not out of all </DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">sites, and having two logout like buttons with similar functionality </DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">is confusing ... I can go into more details, but have written about </DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">it in the past</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV>I would love to hear some more details. Do you have any links to some of these discussions, or any usability data re: this issue, or screenshots of the Sxip 1.0 single-sign-out in action?<DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV>I agree that public computers are inherently more dangerous and need extra precautions, but I used it as an example because I think it highlights an underlying user experience problem that will eventually need to be addressed one way or the other. Putting on the product manager hat, if I look at something like OpenID and see that it doesn't have single-sign-out it would make me hesitant to implement more complex features like profile/attribute exchange. I believe there can be an implementation that is messaged properly and designed in such a way as to be useful without being irritating. I see a single-sign-out function being the counterpoint to a single-sign-on. If the OpenID spec makes recommendations concerning the sign-in feature, can it make recommendations re: the sign-out feature as well, or at least support the feature if it is implementation specific? It seems that there would need to be some protocol level support for single-sign-out.</DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV><DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" color="#FF0300"><SPAN class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </SPAN>Again I find myself making a suggestion about the browser layer... (Terrell)</FONT></DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV>Re: a browser-level solution is very interesting, but may have too many dependencies. I would think there would have to be consideration for multiple browsers (IE included), backwards compatibility, and pretty constant support. Also, I've found that users do not use their browsers. By that I mean that users tend to focus on the sites they browse not the browser they use to access those sites. I have seen as high as 20% click-through from Google for keywords that include a complete site address (<A href="http://www.yoursitenamehere.com">www.yoursitenamehere.com</A>) on a site with over 10 million registered members. That number translates to people knowing where they want to go and instead of entering the address in the address bar, they enter it into Google. That being said, if done right, a browser-level single-sign-out *could* make for a smoother user experience. In general though, I would prefer to be able to solve this problem before jumping outside the RPs' sites themselves.</DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV>- Josh</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"><DIV><DIV><DIV>On Nov 7, 2006, at 11:14 AM, Dick Hardt wrote:</DIV><BR class="Apple-interchange-newline"><BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">On 6-Nov-06, at 4:41 PM, Joshua Viney wrote:</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">One solution to consider would be a global sign-out feature on <SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">relying party sites that signs users out of their IdP as well.</DIV> </BLOCKQUOTE><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Another solution would be to make very specific recommendations <SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">about messaging users who may be using public computers.</DIV> </BLOCKQUOTE><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">+1</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Using your IdP from a public computer has many risks, and the IdP <SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">should take extra precaution in how it works with users on public <SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">computers.</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">-- Dick</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">_______________________________________________</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">user-experience mailing list</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><A href="mailto:user-experience@openid.net">user-experience@openid.net</A></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><A href="http://openid.net/mailman/listinfo/user-experience">http://openid.net/mailman/listinfo/user-experience</A></DIV> </BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR><DIV> <SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; border-spacing: 0px 0px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; text-align: auto; -khtml-text-decorations-in-effect: none; text-indent: 0px; -apple-text-size-adjust: auto; text-transform: none; orphans: 2; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; border-spacing: 0px 0px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; text-align: auto; -khtml-text-decorations-in-effect: none; text-indent: 0px; -apple-text-size-adjust: auto; text-transform: none; orphans: 2; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; "><DIV>Josh Viney</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><A href="http://www.eastmedia.com/"><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 238); -khtml-text-decorations-in-effect: underline; ">http://www.eastmedia.com</SPAN></A><SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>-- EastMedia</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><A href="http://identity.eastmedia.com/"><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 238); -khtml-text-decorations-in-effect: underline; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 238); -khtml-text-decorations-in-effect: underline; ">http://identity.eastmedia.com</SPAN></SPAN></A><SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>-- OpenID, Identity 2.0</DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><BR class="Apple-interchange-newline"></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV><BR></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></BODY></HTML>