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<div class=Section1>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>This was discussed as the last IIW (see <a
href="http://self-issued.info/?p=256">http://self-issued.info/?p=256</a>).
The point of view taken was there are a number of things being introduced that
will be incompatible with OpenID 2.0 by definition, such as OpenID identifiers
using e-mail syntax. Likewise, there are things that are believed to be
broken, such as having two different specifications for delivering attributes
(both optional!).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>The consensus was that we’ll end up with a cleaner and
easier to implement spec if we don’t require backwards compatibility.
Just like SAML 2.0 is related to, but not compatible with SAML 1.1, we expect
OpenID v.Next to be related to, but not compatible with OpenID 2.0. And
reusing the SAML analogy, it’s common for installations to support both
SAML 1.1 and SAML 2.0 for a transition period while their partners migrate to
SAML 2.0. I expect that a similar migration strategy to be employed by
OpenID installations, in cases where backwards compatibility is important.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Per the last OpenID summit, there’s a reason why RPXNow
has custom code for every major OP. It’s a goal for v.Next to make
that unnecessary…<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'> --
Mike<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Paul E. Jones
[mailto:paulej@packetizer.com] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, May 10, 2010 4:57 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Mike Jones; jsmarr@stanfordalumni.org; openid-specs@lists.openid.net<br>
<b>Cc:</b> tech-comm@openid.net<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: Draft charter for v.Next Attributes working group<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Mike,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Not knowing what discussions took place that led to this
decision, I must say this sounds a bit scary. We’re seeing an
increase in the adoption of OpenID, but loss of backward-compatibility seems
like it would create quite a problem in trying to gain further adoption.
Software all over would have to be upgraded (which would take time and never
happen all at once) and users would be left wondering when OpenID might or
might not work.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I really wish compatibility with OpenID 2.0 would be a definite
goal.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Paul<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Mike Jones
[mailto:Michael.Jones@microsoft.com] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, May 10, 2010 5:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Paul E. Jones; jsmarr@stanfordalumni.org;
openid-specs@lists.openid.net<br>
<b>Cc:</b> tech-comm@openid.net<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: Draft charter for v.Next Attributes working group<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>It’s a statement about v.Next overall.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>
-- Mike<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Paul E. Jones
[mailto:paulej@packetizer.com] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, May 10, 2010 2:42 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> jsmarr@stanfordalumni.org; openid-specs@lists.openid.net<br>
<b>Cc:</b> tech-comm@openid.net<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: Draft charter for v.Next Attributes working group<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Joseph,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>This sentence troubles me a little:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>“Compatibility with OpenID 2.0 is an explicit non-goal for
this work”<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>If users have the right to control what (if any) attributes are
exchanged, then it seems to suggest they could refuse to convey any, in which
case there ought to be a high-degree of interoperability with OpenID 2.0.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Can you elaborate on what that sentence really means? Is
this a generate statement about v.Next (i.e., the larger team is not interested
in preserving backward compatibility), or is this a statement applicable only
to this WG?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Paul<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>
openid-specs-bounces@lists.openid.net [mailto:openid-specs-bounces@lists.openid.net]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Joseph Smarr<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, May 10, 2010 2:09 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> openid-specs@lists.openid.net<br>
<b>Cc:</b> tech-comm@openid.net<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Draft charter for v.Next Attributes working group<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal>Hey guys, I volunteered to drive the "attributes"
working group for OpenID v.Next, so here's a proposed charter, feedback
welcome. Thanks to Mike Jones for actually writing up the first draft and
getting me to act on it! :) js<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
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4.5pt;min-height: 1100px;counter-reset: __goog_page__ 0'>
<div>
<p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;background:white'><span
class=apple-style-span><b><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'>(a) </span></b></span><span style='color:black'> </span><span
class=apple-style-span><b><i><u><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'>Charter</span></u></i></b></span><span class=apple-style-span><b><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>.</span></b></span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:.5in;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><b><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>(i)</span></b></span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'> <b>WG
name:</b> </span></span><span style='color:black'> </span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'>OpenID v.Next</span></span><span style='color:black'> </span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'>Attributes</span></span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:.5in;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><b><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>(ii)</span></b></span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'> <b>Purpose:</b> </span></span><span
style='color:black'> </span><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Produce attribute transmission
and schema specifications for OpenID v.Next that address
the limitations and drawbacks present in the OpenID
2.0 attribute facilities that
limit OpenID’s applicability,
adoption, usability, and interoperability. Sharing basic
data about the user has become a common enough requirement that
OpenID needs to take a more hands-on role in specifying common fields
and also more tightly/actively working on how to propose and accept new
standard fields going forward. Specific goals are:</span></span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:45.0pt;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:Symbol;color:black'>·</span></span><span
style='color:black'> </span><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>define how to ask for
and get rich, consistent, common and extensible data attributes,</span></span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:45.0pt;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:Symbol;color:black'>·</span></span><span
style='color:black'> </span><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>define schemas for
common attributes,</span></span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:45.0pt;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:Symbol;color:black'>·</span></span><span
style='color:black'> </span><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>define a mechanism and
process for using attributes not in this common set,</span></span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:45.0pt;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:Symbol;color:black'>·</span></span><span
style='color:black'> </span><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>enable user control over
what attributes are released,</span></span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:45.0pt;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:Symbol;color:black'>·</span></span><span
style='color:black'> </span><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>enable aggregation of
attributes from multiple verifiable attribute sources,</span></span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:45.0pt;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:Symbol;color:black'>·</span></span><span
style='color:black'> </span><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>enable the use
of attributes by non-browser applications</span></span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:45.0pt;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:Symbol;color:black'>·</span></span><span
style='color:black'> </span><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>enable the use of
attributes both with and without employing an active client,</span></span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:45.0pt;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:Symbol;color:black'>·</span></span><span
style='color:black'> </span><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>seamlessly integrate
with and complement the other OpenID v.Next specifications.</span></span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:.5in;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'> Compatibility
with OpenID 2.0 is an explicit non-goal for this</span></span><span
style='color:black'> </span><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>work.</span></span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:.5in;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><b><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>(iii)</span></b></span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'> <b>Scope:</b> </span></span><span
style='color:black'> </span><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Produce a next
generation OpenID attribute</span></span><span style='color:black'> </span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'>specification or specifications, consistent with the purpose
statement.</span></span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:.5in;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><b><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>(iv)</span></b></span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'> <b>Proposed
List of Specifications</b>: </span></span><span style='color:black'> </span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'>OpenID v.Next Attribute Transmission and Attribute Schema
specifications</span></span><span style='color:black'> </span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'>and possibly related specifications.</span></span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:.5in;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><b><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>(v)</span></b></span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'> <b>Anticipated
audience or users of the work:</b> Implementers of OpenID Providers,
Relying Parties, Active Clients, and non-browser applications</span></span><span
style='color:black'> </span><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>utilizing OpenID.</span></span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:.5in;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><b><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>(vi)</span></b></span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'> <b>Language
in which the WG will conduct business</b>: English.</span></span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:.5in;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><b><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>(vii)</span></b></span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'> <b>Method
of work: </b></span></span><span style='color:black'> </span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'>E-mail discussions on the working group mailing list, working
group conference calls, and face-to-face meetings at the Internet
Identity Workshop and OpenID summits.</span></span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:.5in;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><b><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>(viii)</span></b></span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'> <b>Basis
for determining when the work of the WG is completed:</b> Work will
not be deemed to be complete until there is a consensus that the resulting
protocol specification or family of specifications fulfills the
working group goals. Additional proposed changes beyond that initial
consensus will be evaluated on the basis of whether they increase or
decrease consensus within the working group. The work will be
completed once it is apparent that maximal consensus on the draft has been
achieved, consistent with the purpose and scope.</span></span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;background:white'><span
class=apple-style-span><b><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'>(b) </span></b></span><span style='color:black'> </span><span
class=apple-style-span><b><i><u><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'>Background Information</span></u></i></b></span><span
class=apple-style-span><b><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'>.</span></b></span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:.5in;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><b><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>(i)</span></b></span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'> <b>Related
work being done in other WGs or organizations</b>: </span></span><span
style='color:black'> </span><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>OpenID Authentication
2.0 and related specifications, including Attribute Exchange (AX) and
Simple Registration (SReg). ICF Schemas working group.
Portable Contacts.</span></span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:.5in;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><b><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>(ii)</span></b></span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'> <b>Proposers:</b></span></span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:
.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Joseph Smarr, </span></span><span
style='color:black'><a href="mailto:jsmarr@google.com"><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>jsmarr@google.com</span></span></a></span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'>, Google (chair)</span></span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:
.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><i><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Additional proposers to
be added here</span></i></span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:2.0pt;
margin-left:.5in;background:white'><span class=apple-style-span><b><span
style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>(iii)</span></b></span><span
class=apple-style-span><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:black'> <b>Anticipated
Contributions</b>: None.</span></span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;background:white'><span
style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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