<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div>Tenant 4. The one darin asked about. <br><br>Phil</div><div><br>On Jun 7, 2017, at 2:38 PM, Hardt, Dick <<a href="mailto:dick@amazon.com">dick@amazon.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Which assumption are you referring to Phil?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">On 6/7/17, 2:22 PM, someone claiming to be "Phil Hunt (IDM)" <<a href="mailto:phil.hunt@oracle.com">phil.hunt@oracle.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">I am not seeing the value of the assumption. <o:p></o:p></p>
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Phil<o:p></o:p></p>
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On Jun 7, 2017, at 2:04 PM, McAdams, Darin via Openid-specs-fastfed <<a href="mailto:openid-specs-fastfed@lists.openid.net">openid-specs-fastfed@lists.openid.net</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Anyone disagree with the tenet under discussion?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> # Tenet 4) Push Implementation Complexity onto IdPs</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">The discussion has been about the numbers and ratios, but returning to the main question: if we face a choice between pushing implementation complexity
onto an IdP implementer vs a SP implementer, does anyone disagree about pushing complexity onto the IdP implementer?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">The IdP _<i>administrator</i>_ (as opposed to the implementer) is also important. When using a hosted provider, the admin should see FastFed capabilities
“just appear” when the provider launches it. Admins running their own installation will upgrade to a newer release to get the capabilities. The heavy lifting has been done by their chosen vendor.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Openid-specs-fastfed <<a href="mailto:openid-specs-fastfed-bounces@lists.openid.net">openid-specs-fastfed-bounces@lists.openid.net</a>> on behalf of "<a href="mailto:openid-specs-fastfed@lists.openid.net">openid-specs-fastfed@lists.openid.net</a>"
<<a href="mailto:openid-specs-fastfed@lists.openid.net">openid-specs-fastfed@lists.openid.net</a>><br>
<b>Organization: </b>Gluu<br>
<b>Reply-To: </b>Mike Schwartz <<a href="mailto:mike@gluu.org">mike@gluu.org</a>><br>
<b>Date: </b>Wednesday, June 7, 2017 at 1:48 PM<br>
<b>To: </b>"Hardt, Dick" <<a href="mailto:dick@amazon.com">dick@amazon.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc: </b>"<a href="mailto:openid-specs-fastfed@lists.openid.net">openid-specs-fastfed@lists.openid.net</a>" <<a href="mailto:openid-specs-fastfed@lists.openid.net">openid-specs-fastfed@lists.openid.net</a>><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [Openid-specs-fastfed] FastFed Requirements</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">I agree that IdP vendors < SaaS providers; I don't agree that IdP's <
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">SaaS providers. But if we're talking about admins, why aren't we valuing
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">IdP admins?<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Regarding the ratio... what we find is that the minority of SaaS
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">providers support inbound SAML (and almost none support inbound OpenID
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Connect). That's why so many SSO services are still pushing passwords.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Generally, SaaS providers get serious about supporting SAML when they
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">get a critical mass of requests from their customers. At that point,
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">they can justify the SAML investment. So it's mostly just the larger
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">SaaS providers. Even fewer support OpenID Connect (almost none, Amazon
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">being one of the exceptions).<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">- Mike<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">On 2017-06-07 15:06, Hardt, Dick wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">On 6/7/17, 12:38 PM, someone claiming to be "Openid-specs-fastfed on<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">behalf of <a href="mailto:openid-specs-fastfed@lists.openid.net">
openid-specs-fastfed@lists.openid.net</a>"<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><<a href="mailto:openid-specs-fastfed-bounces@lists.openid.net">openid-specs-fastfed-bounces@lists.openid.net</a> on behalf of<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><a href="mailto:openid-specs-fastfed@lists.openid.net">openid-specs-fastfed@lists.openid.net</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"> More organizations have IDPs then SaaS providers support federated<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"> authentication. Frankly, SaaS providers only support federated
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">authn<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"> when they get enough demand from customers, which sort of speaks to
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">the<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"> ratio I am positing.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Mike: I’m confused what ratio you are implying here. Would you clarify?<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Openid-specs-fastfed mailing list<o:p></o:p></p>
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