[Openid-specs-fapi] Issue #295: Possible support for "embedded" SCA mode (openid/fapi)

Dave Tonge dave.tonge at momentumft.co.uk
Thu Jun 4 12:09:52 UTC 2020


Thanks for sharing Ralph - its an interesting document.

We had a discussion with Francis Pouatcha who brought the issue up again -
as a way of helping harmoisation efforts with the Berlin Group and banks
that have implemented their standards.



On Thu, 4 Jun 2020 at 14:04, Ralph Bragg via Openid-specs-fapi <
openid-specs-fapi at lists.openid.net> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Opinion piece from the EBA on the validity of redirect and decoupled
> flows; I haven't digested the whole lot completely but it's broadly
> supportive of redirect and decoupled provided it's done well.
>
> Dave T - I'm curious about the embedded mode requirement and where this
> has come from?
>
>
> https://eba.europa.eu/eba-publishes-opinion-obstacles-provision-third-party-provider-services-under-payment-services
>
> Cheers,
> Ralph
>
> On 04/06/2020, 11:02, "Openid-specs-fapi on behalf of Joseph Heenan via
> Openid-specs-fapi" <openid-specs-fapi-bounces at lists.openid.net on behalf
> of openid-specs-fapi at lists.openid.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>     > On 4 Jun 2020, at 10:21, Anders Rundgren <
> anders.rundgren.net at gmail.com> wrote:
>     >
>     > On 2020-06-04 11:01, Joseph Heenan wrote:
>     >> Hi Anders,
>     >> Can you describe with a few lines of text (without referring to
> Saturn :-) ) how a protocol could address the EMV use case within FAPI or
> one of the other mechanisms we’re discussing please?
>     >> (
> https://cyberphone.github.io/doc/payments/open-banking-direct-mode.pdf
> seems mostly to be rehashing OpenID’s “sub” and OAuth2’s refresh token, and
> I can’t see where the result differs from using those two?)
>     >
>     > The document you are referring to is the best description I have so
> I can only repeat myself :)
>     >
>     > The technical core of the idea is keeping payment applications like
> EMV, Saturn, FIDO, etc out of the Open Banking API.
>     > The commercial aspect is that such applications would preferably be
> provided by the respective system owner.
>     > The applications (services rather) may or may not be PSD2 compatible.
>     > The scheme builds on using OAuth2 as binding system between these
> services (additional APIs) and the core API, where the former thus works
> like TPPs.
>     > The only really new thing is that the applications are running with
> higher privileges than existing applications since they are supposed to do
> SCA on their own.
>     >
>     > Making Open Banking APIs [technically] usable for any consumer
> payment may not be such a bad idea.
>
>     So if I understand correctly, the problem is with the limitations
> surrounding PSD2 functional APIs?
>
>     The various mechanisms FAPI supports, including CIBA and the embedded
> proposal under discussion, are all suitable for the initial user
> onboarding/binding of the user and (by using refresh tokens) for creating
> persistent sessions from the TPP to the bank for that user, and that no
> changes are necessary to the “security” protocols to enable the EMV use
> case supporting functional APIs you’re describing?
>
>     Thanks
>
>     Joseph
>
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