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    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 02/12/2022 15:04, Torsten
      Lodderstedt wrote:<br>
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          <div class="">Am 02.12.2022 um 15:59 schrieb David Chadwick
            <<a href="mailto:d.w.chadwick@verifiablecredentials.info"
              class="moz-txt-link-freetext" moz-do-not-send="true">d.w.chadwick@verifiablecredentials.info</a>>:</div>
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              <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 02/12/2022 13:48, Torsten
                Lodderstedt wrote:<br class="">
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                cite="mid:E5E4913C-2F58-4D54-ACCA-1D16198989E2@lodderstedt.net"
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                    <div class="">Am 02.12.2022 um 12:46 schrieb David
                      Chadwick <<a
                        href="mailto:d.w.chadwick@verifiablecredentials.info"
                        class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
                        moz-do-not-send="true">d.w.chadwick@verifiablecredentials.info</a>>:</div>
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                        <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 02/12/2022
                          11:24, Torsten Lodderstedt wrote:<br class="">
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                        <blockquote type="cite"
                          cite="mid:5C35187F-2B74-46C6-8AB4-928400230F88@lodderstedt.net"
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                          Hi David,
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                                <div class="">Am 23.11.2022 um 19:14
                                  schrieb David Chadwick via
                                  Openid-specs-ab <<a
                                    href="mailto:openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net"
                                    class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
                                    moz-do-not-send="true">openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a>>:</div>
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                                    <p class="">Hi Torsten</p>
                                    <p class="">excellent work. I fully
                                      support its adoption by the WG</p>
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                              <br class="">
                              Thanks.<br class="">
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                                <div class="">
                                  <div class="">
                                    <p class="">I note however that if
                                      the Verifier uses a QR code to
                                      kick off the transaction, then the
                                      wallet could equally well display
                                      a QR code containing the vp_token
                                      (assuming the VC is small enough)
                                      in which case BLE will not be
                                      needed. This flow should be
                                      supported.</p>
                                  </div>
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                              </blockquote>
                              <div class="">Do you mean the wallet would
                                show a QR code in response to the
                                request encoded in the verifier’s QR
                                code?</div>
                            </div>
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                        </blockquote>
                        <p class="">Yes, the wallet can display a QR
                          code in answer to the verifier's request (in a
                          QRcode). This only works for small VP/VC due
                          to the size restrictions of QR codes, </p>
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                  <div class="">The QR code only contains a small amount
                    of data sufficient to establish a secure connection.
                    The presentation request itself is sent over BLE.
                    Putting the whole request in the QR Code would
                    result in a much bigger QR Code. <br class="">
                  </div>
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              </blockquote>
              <p class="">So you are using the ISO mDL model where the
                initial message only kicks off the BLE, then the request
                and response are sent via BLE. I misunderstood. I
                thought the request was in the QRcode (as per the cross
                device flow) and would have an additional parameter such
                as UseBLE=True; - a bit like we do with Post=True for
                the response)</p>
              <p class="">If you use this model then you dont need a
                special message to kick off the BLE do you?<br class="">
              </p>
              <blockquote type="cite"
                cite="mid:E5E4913C-2F58-4D54-ACCA-1D16198989E2@lodderstedt.net"
                class="">
                <div class="">
                  <div class=""><br class="">
                  </div>
                  <div class="">I would suggest to treat this is a
                    another protocol besides BLE. <br class="">
                  </div>
                </div>
              </blockquote>
              <p class="">Surely it would be better if the RP could
                display one QRcode with it containing the choices that
                the wallet can take, instead of multiple QR codes each
                for a different mode of interaction?</p>
              <div class=""><br class="">
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        <br class="">
        This makes the protocol more complex than it is right now and
        the QR Code back and forth is not super use friendly. <br>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <p>Actually we found it was liked by users in user trials that we
      performed at a cinema during lockdown.</p>
    <p>The cinema displayed a QR code on its window. The customer
      scanned this into their wallet whilst queuing, then on arrival at
      the ticket desk showed their QR code on their wallet to the
      receptionist which scanned it in, and if OK, they were let into
      the cinema. In our case the QRcode was a pointer to a COVID VC,
      but it could just have well been the VC itself. (We built a
      generic model that could cope with any size of VC and any number
      of VCs in the VP, which is why we used a pointer rather than the
      VC itself).</p>
    <p>Kind regards</p>
    <p>David<br>
    </p>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:16428B84-475C-4075-A505-09FFD5F3B249@lodderstedt.net">
      <div><br class="">
      </div>
      <div>I would be reluctant to introduce additional complexity if we
        find out the BLE solution is quick and has a great UX.<br
          class="">
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              <p class="">Kind regards</p>
              <p class="">David<br class="">
              </p>
              <blockquote type="cite"
                cite="mid:E5E4913C-2F58-4D54-ACCA-1D16198989E2@lodderstedt.net"
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                <div class="">
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                      <div class="">
                        <p class="">but it will be a lot simpler than
                          setting up a BLE session (which I always find
                          is tedious to do - e.g. between my car and
                          mobile phone).</p>
                        <div class=""><br class="">
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                  <div class=""><br class="">
                  </div>
                  You don’t need to setup a BLE session yourself with
                  the QR Code approach. That will happen automatically.
                  UX is key! </div>
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                      <div class="">
                        <p class="">Kind regards</p>
                        <p class="">David<br class="">
                        </p>
                        <blockquote type="cite"
                          cite="mid:5C35187F-2B74-46C6-8AB4-928400230F88@lodderstedt.net"
                          class="">
                          <div class="">
                            <div class="">
                              <div class="">
                                <div class=""><br class="">
                                </div>
                                <div class="">best regards.</div>
                                <div class="">Torsten. </div>
                              </div>
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                                <div class="">
                                  <div class="">
                                    <div class=""> <br
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                                    <p class="">Kind regards</p>
                                    <p class="">David<br class="">
                                    </p>
                                    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On
                                      23/11/2022 17:52, Torsten
                                      Lodderstedt via Openid-specs-ab
                                      wrote:<br class="">
                                    </div>
                                    <blockquote type="cite"
                                      cite="mid:025D3FE0-0599-48BA-8E02-A2B1259E09D4@lodderstedt.net"
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                                      Hi all,
                                      <div class=""><br class="">
                                      </div>
                                      <div class="">Kristina, Kenichi,
                                        Sasi, Ramesh, and myself have
                                        been working for a couple of
                                        month on a specification to
                                        enable VC presentation over
                                        BLE. </div>
                                      <div class=""><br class="">
                                      </div>
                                      <div class="">Here is the link the
                                        individual draft: <a
href="https://tlodderstedt.github.io/openid-for-verifiable-presentations-offline-1_0-00.html"
                                          class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
                                          moz-do-not-send="true">https://tlodderstedt.github.io/openid-for-verifiable-presentations-offline-1_0-00.html</a></div>
                                      <div class=""><br class="">
                                      </div>
                                      <div class="">We think this would
                                        be a valuable extension to the
                                        OpenID 4 VCs protocol family as
                                        it would allow offline
                                        presentation (e.g. at the
                                        entrance of a conference or a
                                        restaurant) using the mechanisms
                                        we already have in OpenID4VPs.</div>
                                      <div class=""><br class="">
                                      </div>
                                      <div class="">An implementation of
                                        the spec is under way at MOSIP. </div>
                                      <div class=""><br class="">
                                      </div>
                                      <div class="">We ask the WG to
                                        consider this draft for adoption
                                        as WG document. </div>
                                      <div class=""><br class="">
                                      </div>
                                      <div class="">best regards,</div>
                                      <div class="">Torsten </div>
                                      <br class="">
                                      <fieldset
                                        class="moz-mime-attachment-header"></fieldset>
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