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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Concerning the inclusion of
Fraunhoffer's TRAIN trust framework in PR#107, the paper that
describes TRAIN in detail (for the Open Identity Summit 2022
(<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://oid2022.compute.dtu.dk/">https://oid2022.compute.dtu.dk/</a>)) is not now due to be submitted
until Monday 21 Feb, so I will circulate the paper to the list as
soon as we have submitted it.</div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Kind regards</div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">David<br>
</div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 18/02/2022 08:34, Torsten
Lodderstedt via Openid-specs-ab wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:90C642B0-4D4C-436E-9A68-C16879B323E8@lodderstedt.net">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
Hi,
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">On issue 1400.</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;">
<div class="" style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt;
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Kristina said that DW
indicated on the last Connect call that Ping Identity
plans to use "iss" for a trust framework reference<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div class="" style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt;
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Torsten said that a trust framework reference could be
included elsewhere in the ID Token</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">I also mentioned that OpenID Connect 4 Identity
Assurance (<a
href="https://openid.net/specs/openid-connect-4-identity-assurance-1_0-ID3.html"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext" moz-do-not-send="true">https://openid.net/specs/openid-connect-4-identity-assurance-1_0-ID3.html</a>)
defines syntax for conveying information about trust frameworks
and so on. I suggest to use this as basis for solving Ping’s
requirements. </div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">We also had a good discussion about trust frameworks
and schemes in the context of OIDC4VPs. David has created a PR:
<a href="https://bitbucket.org/openid/connect/pull-requests/107"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext" moz-do-not-send="true">https://bitbucket.org/openid/connect/pull-requests/107</a></div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">@DW: May I ask you to fill an issue with your
requirements? </div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">best regards,</div>
<div class="">Torsten. <br class="">
<div><br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">Am 17.02.2022 um 20:11 schrieb Mike Jones via
Openid-specs-ab <<a
href="mailto:openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext" moz-do-not-send="true">openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a>>:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class="">
<meta charset="UTF-8" class="">
<div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;
caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica;
font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps:
normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;">
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">SIOP Special Call Notes
17-Feb-22<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Mike Jones<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">David Chadwick<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Kristina Yasuda<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Kenichi Nakamura<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Daniel Fett<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Jo Vercammen<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Petteri Stenius<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Torsten Lodderstedt<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Open Pull Requests<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> <span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="https://bitbucket.org/openid/connect/pull-requests/"
style="color: rgb(5, 99, 193); text-decoration:
underline;" class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://bitbucket.org/openid/connect/pull-requests/</a><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> PR #124:
[oidc4vci] clarify sub value in the ID Token Issue
#1426<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
We agreed to merge this<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> PR #107:
Support for federations using the termsOfUse property<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten tried to validate the JSON and it failed<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
David Chadwick said that he believes the JSON is
correct<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
He discussed this on the DIF PE call in the past week<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten said that the PE JSON Schema doesn't work<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
And that some ideas that have been discussed are not
actually in the spec<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten checks all the examples he adds to specs to
make sure they are valid<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Mike stated that we should fix the known syntax
problems in the examples before merging<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
This is related to:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="https://github.com/decentralized-identity/presentation-exchange/issues/303"
style="color: rgb(5, 99, 193); text-decoration:
underline;" class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://github.com/decentralized-identity/presentation-exchange/issues/303</a><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="https://github.com/decentralized-identity/presentation-exchange/issues/280"
style="color: rgb(5, 99, 193); text-decoration:
underline;" class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://github.com/decentralized-identity/presentation-exchange/issues/280</a><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten said that he would work with the PE folks on
these issues<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> PR #120:
Issuer Handling SIOP<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
The corresponding issue is #1400, where there's been
good discussion lately<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Kristina said that DW indicated on the last Connect
call that Ping Identity plans to use "iss" for a trust
framework reference<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten said that a trust framework reference could be
included elsewhere in the ID Token<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten said that the PR is in good shape and includes
the rationale for this change<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Kristina referenced Stephane Durand's comments<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Mike said that merging this will enable us to put
trust in the issuer - unlike<span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="http://self-issued.me/" style="color: rgb(5,
99, 193); text-decoration: underline;" class=""
moz-do-not-send="true">self-issued.me</a><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Kristina said that the PR has been updated to reflect
actionable comments<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Unless more actionable comments have been filed, we
proposed to merge it in a week<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten said that this change surfaces differences in
people's mental models of SIOP<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten said that DW's comments mostly mean that we
need additional data in the ID Token<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten said that these should be captured in separate
issues and not block merging this PR<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> PR #101:
Fetching presentation definitions from a remote
repository<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
David said that he copied the metadata text from
OpenID Connect Discovery<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten said that there's three ways to pass
parameters in connect - in the URI, using "request",
and using "request_uri"<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
He said that the default is that a request conveys all
the parameters in the URI<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Kristina expressed support for having a default<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Mike did too<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
David said that presentation requests can be too big
to include in URIs<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten said to use PAR then<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Kristina said that using request_uri is another way to
handle the large size<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
David said that request_uris can be referenced by
multiple parties, which he sees as being a feature<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten said that doing anything by reference
increases complexity for all parties<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Including hosting and maintaining the externally
referenced data<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Mike asked if Torsten could propose specific changes
to establish the default<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Kristina suggested that we file an issue asking
people's opinion on whether there should be a default
and what it should be<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
David agreed to file that issue<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Jo asked for another week to consider this PR<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Open Issues<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> <span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="https://bitbucket.org/openid/connect/issues?status=new&status=open"
style="color: rgb(5, 99, 193); text-decoration:
underline;" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">https://bitbucket.org/openid/connect/issues?status=new&status=open</a><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> #1436:
Mental Models<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
David observed that sometimes people are talking past
one another because they have different mental models
of SIOP<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
He listed a number of them in the issue<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Kristina made a detailed comment in the issue<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Kristina said that in a recent Connect call, the
biggest confusion observed was between authentication
and conveying claims about the user<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten thanked David for filing the issue<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
He wants to think about the points made and respond<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Mike also requested time to review the details of the
issue<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
We agreed to discuss this on the next SIOP call in a
week<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> #1399:
SIOP with any OIDC flow<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
We agreed to park this until PR #120 is merged<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> #1379:
Resolving Client_ID<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Kristina expressed that we don't need to mandate
registration<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Mike said in Connect Core, we enable registration but
don't mandate it<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
In some cases, registration happens out of band<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
He thought we should do the same here<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten agreed with Mike's comments<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Kristina said that there's a difference between
mandating something and there being a default<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten pointed out that there's a description of
Mandatory to Implement features in OpenID Connect Core<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
See<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="https://openid.net/specs/openid-connect-core-1_0.html#ImplementationConsiderations"
style="color: rgb(5, 99, 193); text-decoration:
underline;" class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://openid.net/specs/openid-connect-core-1_0.html#ImplementationConsiderations</a><o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Mike credited Torsten for that and said that it has
been very useful<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Torsten said that we should do the same thing for SIOP<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
Kristina is resolving this issue until we gain more
deployment experience<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">OpenID Foundation SIOP
Strategy<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> Kristina
reported that there is $12,000 approved for writing a
SIOP whitepaper<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Next Call<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> We are
cancelling the Monday, February 21, 2022 call due to
the Presidents Day holiday in the United States<o:p
class=""></o:p></div>
<div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> The next
Connect call will be on Thursday, February 24, 2022 at
7am Pacific Time<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
</div>
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