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<span style="font-family:"Yu Gothic UI", "Meiryo UI", Meiryo, "MS Pgothic", Osaka, "Segoe UI", -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", sans-serif;font-size:14.6667px;background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255);display:inline !important"><span style="background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255);display:inline !important">DIF
PE is a finished spec in DIF and t</span>echnically n</span><span style="margin:0px;font-size:14.6667px;font-family:"Yu Gothic UI", "Meiryo UI", Meiryo, "MS Pgothic", Osaka, "Segoe UI", -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", sans-serif;background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255);display:inline !important">othing
prevents implementations to use DIF PE in SIOP or any other OIDC flow to request claims. <span style="margin:0px;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"><span style="margin:0px;font-size:14.6667px;font-family:"Yu Gothic UI", "Meiryo UI", Meiryo, "MS Pgothic", Osaka, "Segoe UI", -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", sans-serif;background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255);display:inline !important"><span style="margin:0px;background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255);display:inline !important">What
needs to be discussed is what do we want to use PE for in OIDC and where would it bring most additional value?<span style="margin:0px"> Once we identify that, </span></span></span></span>we just need to clearly define in some document how implementations can
do so in an interoperable way, because DIF PE can be complicated and too flexible sometimes as David Chadvick has pointed out. </span></div>
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> <span style="font-family:"Yu Gothic UI", "Meiryo UI", Meiryo, "MS Pgothic", Osaka, "Segoe UI", -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", sans-serif;font-size:14.6667px;background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255);display:inline !important">Presentation
exchange is a data model for representing a requested format for presentations, and for providing additional metadata for understanding the response.</span></div>
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</span></div>
<div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size: 14.6667px;">This exactly why I think this is not an issue specific to a Self-issued OP model, which focuses on solving the issues particular to this model - such as discovery, registration, proving control
over the subject identifier, etc. <span style="background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255);display:inline !important"><span> </span></span></span></div>
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</span></span></div>
<div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size: 14.6667px;"><span style="background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255);display:inline !important">The main use-cases I have seen using DIF PE in OIDC is to request Verifiable Presentations, in which case, I believe
reference to PE belongs to OIDC4VP (OpenID Connect for Verifiable Presentations) draft under call for adoption. <span style="background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255);display:inline !important">SIOP V2 draft can reference that passage in OIDC4VP draft. </span></span></span></div>
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<div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size: 14.6667px;">> <span style="background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255);display:inline !important"><span> </span>this issue from Daniel was in part a result of me reaching out to him in _anticipation_ of this
becoming an adopted document.</span></span></div>
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<div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size: 14.6667px;">Is the proposal here to adopt DIF PE document in OIDF? as a way to use it with any
<span style="background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255);display:inline !important">OIDC flow with any claims? In that case, it should be merged with expression language work that has been worked on in ekyc-ida WG (</span><a href="https://bitbucket.org/openid/ekyc-ida/issues/1186/expression-language" style="margin:0px;background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255)">openid
/ ekyc-ida / issues / #1186 - Expression Language — Bitbucket</a><span style="background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255);display:inline !important">).</span> </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "yu gothic ui", "meiryo ui", meiryo, "ms pgothic", osaka, "segoe ui", -apple-system, blinkmacsystemfont, roboto, "helvetica neue", sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0);">But
a</span><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: "yu gothic ui", "meiryo ui", meiryo, "ms pgothic", osaka, "segoe ui", -apple-system, blinkmacsystemfont, roboto, "helvetica neue", sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; background-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0);">gain,
I believe reference to a query language belongs to OIDC for VP draft if any.</span></div>
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<div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size: 14.6667px;">Best,</span></div>
<div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size: 14.6667px;">Kristina</span></div>
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<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size:11pt" color="#000000"><b>差出人:</b> Openid-specs-ab <openid-specs-ab-bounces@lists.openid.net> が David Waite via Openid-specs-ab <openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net> の代理で送信<br>
<b>送信日時:</b> 2021年5月7日 14:36<br>
<b>宛先:</b> Artifact Binding/Connect Working Group <openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net>; Anthony Nadalin <nadalin@prodigy.net><br>
<b>CC:</b> David Waite <david@alkaline-solutions.com>; Daniel Buchner <issues-reply@bitbucket.org><br>
<b>件名:</b> Re: [Openid-specs-ab] Issue #1230: Adopt Presentation Exchange as an officially supported mechanism within SIOP (openid/connect)</font>
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> On May 6, 2021, at 7:56 PM, nadalin--- via Openid-specs-ab <openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net> wrote:<br>
> <br>
> So why have we spent time on this in OIDF of DIF has done this,<br>
<br>
DIF has not “done this”. Presentation exchange is a data model for representing a requested format for presentations, and for providing additional metadata for understanding the response. It is not a protocol, and specifically defines carve-outs for the actual
request/response to be defined by separate specifications like SIOP.<br>
<br>
OIDC has a simpler scheme for requesting claims, so the decision was likely made to model that option for the initial submission. I would be surprised if people were unwilling to collaborate on a common ground with DIF, considering the current SIOP work is
a joint effort between DIF and OIDF.<br>
<br>
> this is just another reason why we should not adopt this until we get issues worked out,<br>
<br>
“We” (Connect A/B group) will not get technical issues worked out until we accept something as input. This is currently an external document.
<br>
<br>
Although I cannot speak for everyone, my ability to justify contributions to non-adopted documents and to work under ‘handshake’ IPR does have limits.<br>
<br>
> There is no real reason to do this in OIDF, any work can be done in DIF to fit this into SIOP.<br>
<br>
I would think that changes to SIOP to support new representations of authentication and of claims are squarely in scope of the Connect A/B group. Although my employer was not participating in DIF at the time, I suspect this is the opinion by some of the DIF
membership as well, hence the current joint effort.<br>
<br>
> I'm surprised that this was not all worked out before Mike and others created this draft.<br>
<br>
The purpose of an adopting a submission is not to have a small subset of people work on a document in their own GitHub repo without any IPR protection until they are ready for it to be a ratified standard. A side-effect of this work not being an adopted item
is that I was unaware of it until rather recently.<br>
<br>
Also, I would like to point out that this issue from Daniel was in part a result of me reaching out to him in _anticipation_ of this becoming an adopted document and wanting his input (as primary editor of Presentation Exchange). My hope is that we will reach
the other side of SIOP not just being compatible with PE, but providing feedback to make PE an even more capable specification.<br>
<br>
-DW<br>
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