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<p class="MsoNormal">Spec Call Notes 26-Apr-21<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">John Bradley<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Mike Jones<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Tom Jones<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Kristina Yasuda<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Tim Cappalli<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Adam Lemmon<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Dmitri Zagidulin<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">David Waite (DW)<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Vittorio Bertocci<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Edmund Jay<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Jeremie Miller<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Tobias Looker<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Nat Sakimura<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Learnings from IIW<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> We had a poll among three choices at the SIOP session<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> 10 for using individual claims for W3C VC objects<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> 0 for using aggregated/distributed claims syntax<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> 8 for using a different token type for them<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> As an aside, Tom reported on DIF work using W3C VC objects<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Kristina suggested that we also harmonize with the DIF work on the topic<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> We proposed claim names at <a href="https://openid.bitbucket.io/connect/jwt-claims-for-vc-objects-1_0.html">
https://openid.bitbucket.io/connect/jwt-claims-for-vc-objects-1_0.html</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> We could register those soon, once we have working group consensus to do so<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Vittorio thought that DW's session about logout without cookies was useful<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> He said that while DW's 4-year-old contribution was performant, it could be simpler and less performant<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Mike said that distributed state management is hard<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> DW said that in the face of privacy, all you can have is identifiers and revocation<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> There could be a split between message delivery mechanisms and APIs for doing logout<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> DW said that a simple thing would be to put a squid proxy in front of the OP<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> We would need an API that HTTP caching works with<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> For instance, a revocation yes/no endpoint<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> DW wouldn't recommend a distributed systems approach now because of the privacy issues with it<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> He doesn't want revocation be the point at which I lose privacy<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> He said that communication between the OP and individual RPs is perfect<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> DW said that there's a distinction between logout and an assertion that the RP needs new tokens<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Vittorio said that there was a good discussion with Sam Goto<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Notes from the discussion: <a href="https://docs.google.com/document/d/1UsrQ6lgImgYfgR_mCtS-MWT9ZBR0ZbkQGZP3oMzTDP4/edit">
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1UsrQ6lgImgYfgR_mCtS-MWT9ZBR0ZbkQGZP3oMzTDP4/edit</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> They discussed different logout mechanisms in use, including image tags, iFrames, postMessage, etc.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Sam said that he could image carving out an exception for image tags, since they have limited capabilities<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> iFrames are much tougher to control<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Mike pointed out that you can't do multi-level logout with iFrames<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Vittorio said he understand that, as Auth0 operates intermediaries<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> But Vittorio also said that if we can limit the breakage, that's better than breaking everything<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Vittorio said that the scenarios they're working on currently are about when you don't have third-party cookies<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <a href="https://github.com/IDBrowserUseCases/docs">
https://github.com/IDBrowserUseCases/docs</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Use Cases for SIOP Session<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Vittorio recalled a use case on using VCs for alumni to avoid licensing costs<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Tony Nadalin had talked about using SIOP to present Mobile Driver's Licenses (mDL)<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> This avoids "calling home" at presentation time<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Vittorio said that some use CIBA for this<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> There wasn't overwhelming demand for these use cases<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Kristina said that Japanese universities are often merging, which could make issuance difficult<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Tobias said that there's a number of concepts that have been lumped together<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Having more precision in our conversations would be helpful<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Kristina said that SIOP means something very specific<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> She said that use of VC objects is another thing<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> And portable identifiers are another thing<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> SIOP means an IdP that you control<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Vittorio said that he thinks that some people don't understand that<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> It's not a general bridge between OpenID Connect and decentralized identity<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Nat and Edmund led a discussion on claims aggregation<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> The presentation used was <a href="https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1w-rmwZoLiFWczJ4chXuxhY0OsgHQmlIimS2TNlce4UU/edit?usp=sharing">
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1w-rmwZoLiFWczJ4chXuxhY0OsgHQmlIimS2TNlce4UU/edit?usp=sharing</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> They proposed ways of enabling Claims Providers to be practically used<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Kristina reported on the use of signed sets of claims<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> They discussed whether it's OK to use access tokens at both the UserInfo Endpoint and other endpoints<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> On the call, we had a discussion on use cases for distributed and aggregated claims<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Vittorio pointed out the Azure AD large groups use case<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Nat said that the primary use case for distributed claims is access across different claims providers<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Tom talked about the need for using QR codes and size limitations<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Nat said that when we were designing OpenID Connect, we were very conscious of size limitations<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Tom said that the need for Covid credentials isn't abstract<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Vittorio said that at IIW, many people were complaining that their Covid credential proposals were being ignored<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Tom reported that the EU parliament was meeting about Covid credentials tomorrow<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Vittorio agreed that the IATA Covid credential proposal is solid<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Tom posted SIOP chooser slides with minutes from IIW<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <a href="https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1OaMecHecTUexv1skJZoYzJoHKYH8H03REFpFstLRjPg/edit?ts=6087487b#slide=id.gd2c45a9dcd_2_75">
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1OaMecHecTUexv1skJZoYzJoHKYH8H03REFpFstLRjPg/edit?ts=6087487b#slide=id.gd2c45a9dcd_2_75</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Modified SIOP Special Call Schedule<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> We will be alternating Pacific-friendly and Europe-friendly calls every two weeks<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> The next Europe-Friendly call will be Tuesday, April 27 at 7am Pacific Time<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <a href="https://global.gotomeeting.com/join/191527645">
https://global.gotomeeting.com/join/191527645</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Nat said that that timeslot may conflict with the MODRNA call<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> We'll discuss the preferred call schedule during the call in 14 hours<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Mike said that the other possibility is alternating with the existing Pacific-friendly Connect call time<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> This would next be Thursday, May 6th at 7am Pacific Time<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Open Issues<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <a href="https://bitbucket.org/openid/connect/issues?status=new&status=open">
https://bitbucket.org/openid/connect/issues?status=new&status=open</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> We ran out of time to get to this<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Next Calls<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> The next regular Connect call is scheduled for Thursday, April 29nd, 2021 at 7am Pacific Time<o:p></o:p></p>
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