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<font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">If it's a caching
mechanism, can we just use HTTP cache semantics as issued by the
OP at time of first retrieval of the data? I worry that what an AS
considers as an "update" will fluctuate substantially such that
how well the mechanism works will be diluted unless some criteria
can be set around what constitutes an "update":)<br>
<br>
Thanks,<br>
George<br>
</font><br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2/5/16 8:45 AM, Justin Richer wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:56B4A774.1010507@mit.edu" type="cite">
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Right, the mechanism is already in the protocol, but it's awkward
to process (not every client or idp implements "claims", which is
fairly complex to support in full). I was proposing the stance of
including it by default and checking for it by default for what is
effectively cache management.<br>
<br>
-- Justin<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2/5/2016 3:32 AM, Vladimir
Dzhuvinov wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:56B45E2F.2080206@connect2id.com" type="cite">
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Haven't we already got the updated_at claim for this purpose?
RPs can request updated_at to be included in the ID token via
the "claims" param.<br>
<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://openid.net/specs/openid-connect-core-1_0.html#StandardClaims">http://openid.net/specs/openid-connect-core-1_0.html#StandardClaims</a><br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 04/02/16 23:42, George Fletcher
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:56B3C5AF.70906@aol.com" type="cite">I like
the idea but it feels like whether it's useful or not is
completely dependent on the implementation of the AS. If the
AS identity record has a "last accessed" field that I update
every time the user authenticates or SSO's then the
'last_updated' value will almost always be different than what
the client has. However, if the identity record just has
username and email address then the 'last_updated' value would
rarely change and it would be very useful to the clients. Of
course real practice is somewhere in the middle:) <br>
<br>
Thanks, <br>
George <br>
<br>
On 2/4/16 1:29 PM, Justin Richer wrote: <br>
<blockquote type="cite">You can still do all of these other
things below as well, this doesn’t preclude them. For most,
making the call at all is the trouble, not the size of the
response. If I can avoid the network roundtrip then we’re in
better shape. <br>
<br>
It’s a very small delta to the ID token. <br>
<br>
— Justin <br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">On Feb 4, 2016, at 11:27 AM, John
Bradley <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:ve7jtb@ve7jtb.com"><ve7jtb@ve7jtb.com></a>
wrote: <br>
<br>
I see why you might want to do that. <br>
<br>
That however release on the user being present to do an
authentication. <br>
<br>
I would prefer to find a more REST like approach where the
client can use its token to do a HEAD of the user-info
endpoint to see if the resource has changed. <br>
<br>
That may well be harder to do in implementations however.
<br>
<br>
Back channel calls are not that expensive compared to
making all id_tokens larger. <br>
<br>
Is it the size of the response that bothers people, or
checking at all? <br>
<br>
We could just add a last changed claim to user_info so
that the client would not need to process the response,
but that probably doesn’t save much. <br>
<br>
The concern with adding it to the id_token is that people
may add it by default, and it not be used by clients. <br>
<br>
If we add it it should be explicitly asked for as a scope.
<br>
<br>
John B. <br>
<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">On Feb 4, 2016, at 1:05 PM, Justin
Richer <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:jricher@MIT.EDU"><jricher@MIT.EDU></a>
wrote: <br>
<br>
One of the good things in OIDC is the fact that the
claims about a user are split between the ID Token
(things that are needed for the authN transaction) and
the user info endpoint (things that are needed for the
profile and other functions of the app). Theoretically
it cuts down on sending redundant and unchanging
information with each authentication. However, the
tension of whether and when an RP should pull from the
IdP’s UserInfo Endpoint is an age old question of cache
consistency. Should the RP call on each transaction?
After a time out? When it really really wants to? <br>
<br>
Anyway, I think there’s a simple way that the IdP can
signal to the RP whether it’s worth pulling information.
If the IdP always includes the “last_updated” claim in
the ID token, the RP can decide whether its cache of
UserInfo is fresh enough or not by doing a simple
comparison on that value and its local cache. It’s
coarse grained, because you don’t know if you care about
whatever claim was updated or not, but it’s at least
*some* signal that can be used inside an already
existing structure. <br>
<br>
We’re considering just implementing this in our server
and client, but I’d like to see what others thought of
this idea and if it would be worthwhile propagating this
pattern. I feel it’s very low overhead in the ID Token
for a potentially big benefit of live data and lower
network traffic from the RP. <br>
<br>
— Justin <br>
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<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
Chief Architect
Identity Services Engineering Work: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:george.fletcher@teamaol.com">george.fletcher@teamaol.com</a>
AOL Inc. AIM: gffletch
Mobile: +1-703-462-3494 Twitter: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://twitter.com/gffletch">http://twitter.com/gffletch</a>
Office: +1-703-265-2544 Photos: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://georgefletcher.photography">http://georgefletcher.photography</a>
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