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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Changing hands doesn’t mean that it’s authorized. It just means that the token has been leaked to an unauthorized party.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> -- Mike<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Nat Sakimura [mailto:sakimura@gmail.com]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 28, 2013 4:51 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Mike Jones<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Tim Bray; openid-specs-ab<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Openid-specs-ab] OpenID Connect and Identity Delegation<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Which is not the case that it may sometime change the hand. The name bearer suggests otherwise as well. Bearer is whoever has it. <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">From Oxford Dictionary: <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="iteration"><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:#333333;border:none windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;background:white">1</span></b></span><span class="definition"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:#333333;border:none windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;background:white">a
person or thing that carries or holds something:</span></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="iteration"><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:#333333;border:none windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;background:white">2</span></b></span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:#333333;background:white">a
person who presents a cheque or other order to pay money:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">And here is a description of "bearer bond" from wikipedia: <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";background:white">A <b>bearer bond</b> is a debt security issued by a business entity, such as a corporation, or by a government. It differs from the more common types of investment
securities in that it is unregistered – no records are kept of the owner, or the transactions involving ownership. Whoever physically holds the paper on which the bond is issued owns the </span><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Financial_instrument" title="Financial instrument"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#0B0080;background:white;text-decoration:none">instrument</span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";background:white">.
This is useful for </span><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Investor" title="Investor"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#0B0080;background:white;text-decoration:none">investors</span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";background:white"> who
wish to retain anonymity. Recovery of the value of a bearer bond in the event of its loss, theft, or destruction is usually impossible. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">At the same time, bearer is more privacy preserving in some sense. In a "registered token", i.e., token with the "azp", it is impossible to hide who is presenting it. <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Nat<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">2013/3/29 Mike Jones <<a href="mailto:Michael.Jones@microsoft.com" target="_blank">Michael.Jones@microsoft.com</a>><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I think I disagree with this statement. I had thought that without an “azp” claim, there is exactly
one authorized presenter – the client that requested the token.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">All of this discussion does point out that “azp” truly is underspecified – which was Brian’s primary
observation. Otherwise we wouldn’t have experts who wrote the specs with different views on what the claim means.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> -- Mike</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Nat Sakimura [mailto:<a href="mailto:sakimura@gmail.com" target="_blank">sakimura@gmail.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 28, 2013 4:26 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Tim Bray<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Mike Jones; openid-specs-ab</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Openid-specs-ab] OpenID Connect and Identity Delegation<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">+1 ID Token without azp is equivalent to say, "azp":"*". That's what we call as bearer. In essence, azp is scoping the "from" and aud is scoping the "to". <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">As to the text itself is concerned, there has been a request from Breno on the text, however, and we should take that into account as well. <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Nat<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">2013/3/29 Tim Bray <<a href="mailto:tbray@textuality.com" target="_blank">tbray@textuality.com</a>><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">I agree with Mike’s characterization. Why not include that exact sentence in the spec?<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">On Thu, Mar 28, 2013 at 11:06 AM, Mike Jones <<a href="mailto:Michael.Jones@microsoft.com" target="_blank">Michael.Jones@microsoft.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">An audience is a party that the token can be legally presented to. The authorized presenter (azp)
is a party that can legally present the token to those audiences.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> -- Mike</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">
<a href="mailto:openid-specs-ab-bounces@lists.openid.net" target="_blank">openid-specs-ab-bounces@lists.openid.net</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:openid-specs-ab-bounces@lists.openid.net" target="_blank">openid-specs-ab-bounces@lists.openid.net</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Brian Campbell<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 28, 2013 11:00 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Matias Woloski<br>
<b>Cc:</b> openid-specs-ab<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Openid-specs-ab] OpenID Connect and Identity Delegation</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">On Thu, Mar 28, 2013 at 11:55 AM, Matias Woloski <<a href="mailto:matiasw@gmail.com" target="_blank">matiasw@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<ul type="disc">
<li class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1">
What is the difference between having multiple audiences vs using azp?<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">FWIW, I've long had the same question. Which is mentioned, among others about azp, in
<a href="https://bitbucket.org/openid/connect/issue/830/what-is-azp-really" target="_blank">
https://bitbucket.org/openid/connect/issue/830/what-is-azp-really</a> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt">_______________________________________________<br>
Openid-specs-ab mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net" target="_blank">Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a><br>
<a href="http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab" target="_blank">http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
Openid-specs-ab mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net" target="_blank">Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a><br>
<a href="http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab" target="_blank">http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
<br>
Nat Sakimura (=nat)<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Chairman, OpenID Foundation<br>
<a href="http://nat.sakimura.org/" target="_blank">http://nat.sakimura.org/</a><br>
@_nat_en<o:p></o:p></p>
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<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">-- <br>
Nat Sakimura (=nat)<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Chairman, OpenID Foundation<br>
<a href="http://nat.sakimura.org/" target="_blank">http://nat.sakimura.org/</a><br>
@_nat_en<o:p></o:p></p>
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