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    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">+1 <br>
      (could not agree more to every aspect of this)<br>
      <br>
      Henrik<br>
      <div class="moz-signature"><br>
        <font face="Verdana, sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font
              size="2"></font></font></font></div>
      Den 08-03-2013 02:04, John Bradley wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
      cite="mid:4A8C4292-A180-4526-B032-56AD557AC759@ve7jtb.com"
      type="cite">
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      The discussion on the call was not against verification in any way
      but that multiple phone numbers etc are all part of existing
      schemas.
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>For complicated provisioning we should be pointing to SCIM or
        some other schema rather than incrementally adding to the simple
        account registration schema that we defined for the user_info
        endpoint.</div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>Once we start adding elements piecemeal it is a slippery
        slope.   What about work and personal mobile and home vs work
        landline.  We also have Multiple postal , home and work
        addresses each of those can also be verified as in the Yahoo
        Japan case.</div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>So I would not characterize the discussion as rejecting the
        notion of phone verification only saying that the existing
        schema is intended to be as simple as possible for account
        registration based on current RP experience from Google Facebook
        and others.</div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>If we are going to do something more complex it needs to be
        done as a proper schema design and not tacked on to the current
        account registration schema incrementally.</div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>That leaves SCIM, portableContacts , EDUPerson and perhaps AD
        schemas as possibilities. (some much better than others) </div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>We need to have that discussion in a larger group.     I
        prefer to have the larger discussion rather than picking
        elements off one at a time.</div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>John B.</div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>
        <div>
          <div>On 2013-03-08, at 9:14 AM, Nat Sakimura <<a
              moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:sakimura@gmail.com">sakimura@gmail.com</a>>
            wrote:</div>
          <br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
          <blockquote type="cite">As the chair of the WG, I have a bit
            of problem to state that "the working group decided" here.
            WG is not just the people who have called in to a telephone
            conference but the sum of the all people who is expressing
            their desire. 
            <div>
              <br>
            </div>
            <div>From the minute, I see that John Bradley, Mike Jones,
              Roland Hedberg, Justin Richer, Brian Campbell, Edmund Jay,
              George Fletcher, Pamela Dingle was in the call but those
              people on this thread, me, nov, Ryo, Chuck, and Torsten
              expressing the desire in having mobile number were not.
              Given that I heard this desire from another WG person, I
              suspect that there are more people thinking the same. I
              gather that the consensus is not yet reached. </div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>
              <div>I would float the issue for a few more days -- till
                Sunday US time. </div>
              <div><br>
              </div>
              <div>Please discuss. </div>
              <div><br>
              </div>
              <div>Nat</div>
              <div><br>
                <div class="gmail_quote">2013/3/8 Mike Jones <span
                    dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                      href="mailto:Michael.Jones@microsoft.com"
                      target="_blank">Michael.Jones@microsoft.com</a>></span><br>
                  <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
                    .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">FYI,
                    the working group decided to keep only a single
                    phone number, because even that isn't typically
                    needed for our design use case for the UserInfo
                    Endpoint, which is enabling easy interaction with
                    basic RPs.  In particular, people felt strongly that
                    we shouldn't be inventing new Connect-specific phone
                    number schemas; if people need more specific data,
                    they should probably use schemas that already exist,
                    such as Portable Contacts or SCIM.<br>
                    <br>
                    We *did*, however, decide to clarify how phone
                    numbers with extensions should be represented.<br>
                    <br>
                    See <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                      href="https://bitbucket.org/openid/connect/issue/800/"
                      target="_blank">https://bitbucket.org/openid/connect/issue/800/</a>
                    for more details.<br>
                    <br>
                                                    -- Mike<br>
                    <div class="im"><br>
                      -----Original Message-----<br>
                      From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                        href="mailto:openid-specs-ab-bounces@lists.openid.net">openid-specs-ab-bounces@lists.openid.net</a>
                      [mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                        href="mailto:openid-specs-ab-bounces@lists.openid.net">openid-specs-ab-bounces@lists.openid.net</a>]
                      On Behalf Of Chuck Mortimore<br>
                      Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2013 8:51 AM<br>
                      To: Ryo Ito<br>
                      Cc: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                        href="mailto:openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net">openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a><br>
                      Subject: Re: [Openid-specs-ab] Feedback on
                      UserInfo schema<br>
                      <br>
                      +1 although I wouldn't constrain to SMS as the
                      verification method, and<br>
                    </div>
                    +simply say mobile_phone_verified<br>
                    <div class="HOEnZb">
                      <div class="h5"><br>
                        - cmort<br>
                        <br>
                        On Mar 7, 2013, at 8:30 AM, "Ryo Ito" <<a
                          moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:ritou.06@gmail.com">ritou.06@gmail.com</a>>
                        wrote:<br>
                        <br>
                        > Some services verify user's mobile phone
                        number by sending SMS.<br>
                        > "sms_verified" claim may be useful if
                        "mobile_phone" scope is defined.<br>
                        > This is the same as relations of "email"
                        and "email_verified" claims.<br>
                        ><br>
                        > Ryo<br>
                        ><br>
                        > 2013/3/8 nov matake <<a
                          moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:nov@matake.jp">nov@matake.jp</a>>:<br>
                        >> Does "phone" scope include
                        "mobile_number" claim?<br>
                        >> or do we need another scope for mobile
                        phone?<br>
                        >><br>
                        >> I think we need "mobile_phone" scope.<br>
                        >><br>
                        >> On 2013/03/07, at 6:54, Nat Sakimura
                        <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:sakimura@gmail.com">sakimura@gmail.com</a>>
                        wrote:<br>
                        >><br>
                        >> I am fine with it, though how to create
                        "formatted phone number"<br>
                        >> needs to be clarified. Is it just how
                        the user entered or created<br>
                        >> algorithmically? If the later, the OP
                        needs to have translation<br>
                        >> template for each countries as they
                        widely varies. As to the syntax<br>
                        >> is concerned, I prefer
                        phone_number_formatted instead of<br>
                        >> formatted_phone_number. Also, a +1 for
                        making E.164 a MUST for the machine consumption.<br>
                        >><br>
                        >> With respect to phone number, it just
                        reminded me of the fact that<br>
                        >> multiple sources expressed desire to
                        differentiate land line phone<br>
                        >> number and mobile phone number. Their
                        characteristics as to the<br>
                        >> binding strength to the subject is very
                        different. Land line usually<br>
                        >> is only bound to the "home / household"
                        or "office location", the<br>
                        >> mobile phone number is much more
                        tightly coupled with the person /<br>
                        >> subject. So, actually, you may not want
                        to treat them as a single class.<br>
                        >><br>
                        >> So, in addition to phone_number, I
                        would like to propose<br>
                        >> mobile_number as well.<br>
                        >><br>
                        >> Nat<br>
                        >><br>
                        >><br>
                        >> 2013/3/7 Mike Jones <<a
                          moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:Michael.Jones@microsoft.com">Michael.Jones@microsoft.com</a>><br>
                        >>><br>
                        >>> I would be fine with having both
                        phone number claims.<br>
                        >>> "formatted_phone_number" could be
                        the display form (just like<br>
                        >>> "formatted" is the address display
                        form) and "phone_number" could be an RFC 3966
                        phone<br>
                        >>> number.   The "phone" scope would
                        request both.<br>
                        >>><br>
                        >>> What claim names is Google actually
                        using for these values today?<br>
                        >>><br>
                        >>> What do others think?<br>
                        >>><br>
                        >>>                                --
                        Mike<br>
                        >>><br>
                        >>> -----Original Message-----<br>
                        >>> From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:openid-specs-ab-bounces@lists.openid.net">openid-specs-ab-bounces@lists.openid.net</a><br>
                        >>> [mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:openid-specs-ab-bounces@lists.openid.net">openid-specs-ab-bounces@lists.openid.net</a>]
                        On Behalf Of Breno<br>
                        >>> de Medeiros<br>
                        >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013
                        9:15 AM<br>
                        >>> To: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net">openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a><br>
                        >>> Subject: [Openid-specs-ab] Feedback
                        on UserInfo schema<br>
                        >>><br>
                        >>> Google returns phone numbers in two
                        different formats: The<br>
                        >>> display-friendly displayable format
                        that follows the user<br>
                        >>> preferences on how they see the
                        number, and a standard-compliant form for
                        machines.<br>
                        >>><br>
                        >>> The UserInfo spec documents a
                        'phone_number' field that appears to<br>
                        >>> try to be both. It's the user
                        'preferred' phone number (indicating<br>
                        >>> some allowance for
                        display-friendliness) and then only RECOMMENDS
                        format compliance.<br>
                        >>><br>
                        >>> Option 1. Define two fields:
                        display_phone_number and<br>
                        >>> std_phone_number, where the latter
                        MUST be in the E164 or RFC3966<br>
                        >>> (the latter deals with phone
                        extensions as well).<br>
                        >>><br>
                        >>> Option 2. Clarify the current
                        language by replacing RECOMMENDED with<br>
                        >>> MUST if the desire is to support
                        machine use cases<br>
                        >>><br>
                        >>> Option 3. Clarity the current
                        language by saying that this is for<br>
                        >>> display purposes only.<br>
                        >>><br>
                        >>> --<br>
                        >>> --Breno<br>
                        >>>
                        _______________________________________________<br>
                        >>> Openid-specs-ab mailing list<br>
                        >>> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net">Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a><br>
                        >>> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab"
                          target="_blank">http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab</a><br>
                        >>>
                        _______________________________________________<br>
                        >>> Openid-specs-ab mailing list<br>
                        >>> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net">Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a><br>
                        >>> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab"
                          target="_blank">http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab</a><br>
                        >><br>
                        >><br>
                        >><br>
                        >><br>
                        >> --<br>
                        >> Nat Sakimura (=nat)<br>
                        >> Chairman, OpenID Foundation<br>
                        >> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="http://nat.sakimura.org/"
                          target="_blank">http://nat.sakimura.org/</a><br>
                        >> @_nat_en<br>
                        >>
                        _______________________________________________<br>
                        >> Openid-specs-ab mailing list<br>
                        >> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net">Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a><br>
                        >> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab"
                          target="_blank">http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab</a><br>
                        >><br>
                        >><br>
                        >><br>
                        >>
                        _______________________________________________<br>
                        >> Openid-specs-ab mailing list<br>
                        >> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net">Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a><br>
                        >> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab"
                          target="_blank">http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab</a><br>
                        ><br>
                        ><br>
                        ><br>
                        > --<br>
                        > ====================<br>
                        > Ryo Ito<br>
                        > Email : <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:ritou.06@gmail.com">ritou.06@gmail.com</a><br>
                        > ====================<br>
                        >
                        _______________________________________________<br>
                        > Openid-specs-ab mailing list<br>
                        > <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net">Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a><br>
                        > <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab"
                          target="_blank">http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab</a><br>
                        _______________________________________________<br>
                        Openid-specs-ab mailing list<br>
                        <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net">Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a><br>
                        <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab"
                          target="_blank">http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab</a><br>
                        _______________________________________________<br>
                        Openid-specs-ab mailing list<br>
                        <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net">Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a><br>
                        <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab"
                          target="_blank">http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab</a><br>
                      </div>
                    </div>
                  </blockquote>
                </div>
                <br>
                <br clear="all">
                <div><br>
                </div>
                -- <br>
                Nat Sakimura (=nat)
                <div>Chairman, OpenID Foundation<br>
                  <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                    href="http://nat.sakimura.org/" target="_blank">http://nat.sakimura.org/</a><br>
                  @_nat_en</div>
              </div>
            </div>
            _______________________________________________<br>
            Openid-specs-ab mailing list<br>
            <a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="mailto:Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net">Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a><br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab">http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab</a><br>
          </blockquote>
        </div>
        <br>
      </div>
      <br>
      <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
      <br>
      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
Openid-specs-ab mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net">Openid-specs-ab@lists.openid.net</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab">http://lists.openid.net/mailman/listinfo/openid-specs-ab</a>
</pre>
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