[Openid-specs-ab] [OAUTH-WG] Simple Web Discovery

Anthony Nadalin tonynad at microsoft.com
Fri Oct 29 16:37:03 UTC 2010


Like an XML parser

-----Original Message-----
From: Eran Hammer-Lahav [mailto:eran at hueniverse.com] 
Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 9:24 AM
To: Anthony Nadalin; John Bradley
Cc: sampo at zxidp.org; openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net; the Connect work group; oauth at ietf.org
Subject: RE: [OAUTH-WG] [Openid-specs-ab] Simple Web Discovery

Can you list those "quite a few more complex feature"?

XRD (and JRD) were carefully balanced over 3 years to produce a simple specification that covers basic discovery needs without any unnecessary complexity. It was coordinated with IETF, OASIS, OpenID, and W3C efforts, and successfully adopted by new lightweight protocols. To invent yet another format that is clearly overlapping without even trying to engage in the XRD/JRD work is poor community participation.

EHL

> -----Original Message-----
> From: oauth-bounces at ietf.org [mailto:oauth-bounces at ietf.org] On Behalf 
> Of Anthony Nadalin
> Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 8:57 AM
> To: John Bradley
> Cc: sampo at zxidp.org; openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net; the Connect 
> work group; oauth at ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [OAUTH-WG] [Openid-specs-ab] Simple Web Discovery
> 
> I would not say that this is just a JSON version of XRD, as XRD has 
> quite a few more complex feature. What is being suggested here is 
> being able to use OAuth for the authorization/delegation to discovery 
> information in a very simple chunkable forward means.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Bradley [mailto:jbradley at mac.com]
> Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2010 5:22 PM
> To: Anthony Nadalin
> Cc: the Connect work group; sampo at zxidp.org; openid-specs- 
> ab at lists.openid.net; oauth at ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [Openid-specs-ab] [OAUTH-WG] Simple Web Discovery
> 
> If there is no authorization mechanism,  then this is just a JSON 
> version of XRD.
> 
> Not that you couldn't add authorization to XRD.
> 
> We were planning on doing that as an option for a proxy resolution 
> flow that would look quite similar.
> 
> The way that the existing XRI resolver works is quite similar to what 
> you describe filtering by service.
> One of the use cases has been adding authentication, but there was 
> never enough interest.
> 
> Too bad MS didn't participate in XRD.
> 
> John B.
> On 2010-10-28, at 8:42 PM, Anthony Nadalin wrote:
> 
> > So not sure that this would be handled by the SWD itself but as 
> > pointed out in the SWD specification is that the SWD may be 
> > accompanied by an authorization header and this is where I would 
> > expect that to happen
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: openid-specs-connect-bounces at lists.openid.net
> > [mailto:openid-specs-connect-bounces at lists.openid.net] On Behalf Of 
> > John Bradley
> > Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2010 8:41 AM
> > To: the Connect work group
> > Cc: sampo at zxidp.org; openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net; 
> > oauth at ietf.org
> > Subject: Re: [Openid-specs-ab] [OAUTH-WG] Simple Web Discovery
> >
> > In the case where the user logs in to a RP with a PPID type identifier.
> >
> > How could the person then allow the RP to discover their service
> endpoints.
> > Also conversely would publishing the endpoint provide a way for the 
> > RP to
> correlate the user without permission.
> >
> > One common practice for openID PPID is that the IdP generates the 
> > PPID
> via AES128(actual ID + RP or sector identifier).
> >
> > In that case the RP could do an oauth flow to the IdP discovery 
> > endpoint to
> get permission to see the user endpoints.
> > The IdP could decrypt the opaque identifier to determine the actual
> subject.
> >
> > That would protect the non correlation unless the user decides to 
> > permit
> discovery.
> >
> > The model if not the details seem similar to some work that is being
> submitted to the ITU-T as I understand it.
> >
> > John B.
> >
> >
> > On 2010-10-28, at 12:07 PM, Anthony Nadalin wrote:
> >
> >> Sampo, can you give a usecase of how you would use the pairwise
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: openid-specs-ab-bounces at lists.openid.net
> >> [mailto:openid-specs-ab-bounces at lists.openid.net] On Behalf Of 
> >> sampo at zxidp.org
> >> Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2010 6:40 PM
> >> To: Mike Jones
> >> Cc: sampo at zxidp.org; openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net; 
> >> oauth at ietf.org; openid-specs-connect at lists.openid.net
> >> Subject: Re: [Openid-specs-ab] [OAUTH-WG] Simple Web Discovery
> >>
> >> Simple enough spec. I like the notion of service type. However some
> questions to answer:
> >>
> >> How would one convey saml2:Assertion as the "principal"? Or how 
> >> would
> one convey a saml2:NameID as the "principal"?
> >>
> >> Or in more generic sense, how would one convey a pairwise pseudonym
> as principal?
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> --Sampo
> >>
> >> Mike Jones <Michael.Jones at microsoft.com> said:
> >>> Having a simple discovery method for services and resources is key 
> >>> to
> enabling many Internet scenarios that require interactions among 
> parties that do not have pre-established relationships.  For instance, 
> if Joe, with e- mail address joe at example.com, wants to share his 
> calendar with Mary, then Mary's calendar service, in the general case, 
> will need to discover the location of Joe's calendar service.  For 
> example, Mary's calendar service might discover that Joe's calendar 
> service is located at http://calendars.proseware.com/calendar/joseph 
> by doing discovery for a service named urn:adatum.com:calendar  at 
> example.com for the account joe.
> >>>
> >>> Yaron Goland<http://www.goland.org/> and I are submitting this 
> >>> Simple
> Web Discovery 
> (SWD)<http://self-issued.info/docs/draft-jones-simple-web-
> discovery-00.html> draft (attached and at 
> http://self-issued.info/docs/draft-
> jones-simple-web-discovery-00.html) for consideration by the community 
> to address this need.  SWD is simple to understand and implement, 
> enables different permissions to be applied to discovery of different 
> services, and is JSON-based.  I look forward to discussing this with 
> many of you next week at
> IIW<http://www.internetidentityworkshop.com/iiwxi-11-in-mountain-
> view/>.
> >>>
> >>>                                                               -- 
> >>> Mike
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> OAuth mailing list
> >>> OAuth at ietf.org
> >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/oauth
> >>>
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