[Openid-specs-ab] Session ID semantics aligned across OpenID Connect front-channel and back-channel logout specs

[Mike Jones]

Suggested text capturing these points would be great.

From: Brian Campbell<mailto:bcampbell at pingidentity.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2016 12:39 PM
To: Thomas Broyer<mailto:t.broyer at ltgt.net>
Cc: Mike Jones<mailto:Michael.Jones at microsoft.com>; Phil Hunt (IDM)<mailto:phil.hunt at oracle.com>; openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net<mailto:openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net>
Subject: Re: [Openid-specs-ab] Session ID semantics aligned across OpenID Connect front-channel and back-channel logout specs

I would say yes, Thomas, but I think the answer will depend on who you ask and when.

Typically, in my own experience anyway, the SSO token (like the id token) has a relatively short expiration time and is consumed and validated by the client/RP once and then that client sets up its own session or security context with its own lifetime.

But I think some have used or want to use the id token directly as the session token at the client/RP. And doing so might then rely on the exp in the id token as the session expiration, which presumably would want a larger window.

I don't think the spec(s) explicitly require one approach or the other. And, as such, I don't think any of the logout stuff can assume one or the other.




On Wed, Aug 24, 2016 at 10:19 AM, Thomas Broyer via Openid-specs-ab <openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net<mailto:openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net>> wrote:
Aren't ID Tokens supposed to have a short expiration time? (I asked twice already over the last 2 years and never got an answer, maybe this time?)

On Wed, Aug 24, 2016 at 6:05 PM Mike Jones via Openid-specs-ab <openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net<mailto:openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net>> wrote:
I found your original logic to be sound.  The ID Token could be reused with id_token_hint until it expires. Communicating the matching expiration time in the logout made sense to me - particularly in the no Session ID case, as John points out.

- Mike

From: Phil Hunt (IDM)<mailto:phil.hunt at oracle.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2016 11:45 AM
To: Phil Hunt (IDM)<mailto:phil.hunt at oracle.com>
Cc: Mike Jones<mailto:Michael.Jones at microsoft.com>; openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net<mailto:openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net>

Subject: Re: [Openid-specs-ab] Session ID semantics aligned across OpenID Connect front-channel and back-channel logout specs
Scratch that. Was thinking oauth resource and tokens.

Not sure the same would exist here.

Phil

On Aug 24, 2016, at 8:17 AM, Phil Hunt (IDM) via Openid-specs-ab <openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net<mailto:openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net>> wrote:

It may be useful to include the original session expiry time or make the exp match the original id token. If the service isn't tracking state of sessions it needs to know for how much longer an id token might show up in order to keep its revocation list managed over time.

Phil

On Aug 24, 2016, at 5:58 AM, Mike Jones via Openid-specs-ab <openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net<mailto:openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net>> wrote:

Good catch, Filip.  I'd replaced "exp" (expiration time) with "iat" (issued at) to align it with the ID Events spec https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-hunt-idevent-token-03.  But I'd also wanted to ask the working group - do we want to retain an explicit expiration time in the logout token?

                                                       -- Mike

From: Filip [mailto:panva.ip at gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2016 1:24 AM
To: Mike Jones <Michael.Jones at microsoft.com<mailto:Michael.Jones at microsoft.com>>
Cc: openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net<mailto:openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net>
Subject: Re: [Openid-specs-ab] Session ID semantics aligned across OpenID Connect front-channel and back-channel logout specs

Hello,

reviewing the changes i noticed in Section 2.4 of Backchannel draft 03 the 'exp' claim got removed from Logout Token claims, however section 4 still recomends OPs to use short expiration times for their Logout Tokens. It is not clear enough if 'exp' should be present or not.

Best Regards,
Filip Skokan

On Wed, Aug 24, 2016 at 3:44 AM, Mike Jones via Openid-specs-ab <openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net<mailto:openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net>> wrote:
Session ID definitions in the OpenID Connect front-channel and back-channel logout specs have been aligned so that the Session ID definition is now the same in both specs.  The Session ID is scoped to the Issuer in both specs now (whereas it was previously global in scope in the front-channel spec).  This means that the issuer value now needs to be supplied whenever the Session ID is.  This doesn't change the simple (no-parameter) front-channel logout messages.  The back-channel specification is now also aligned with the ID Event Token specification.

The new specification versions are:

*       http://openid.net/specs/openid-connect-frontchannel-1_0-01.html

*       http://openid.net/specs/openid-connect-backchannel-1_0-03.html

                                                       -- Mike

P.S.  This notice was also posted at http://self-issued.info/?p=1599 and as @selfissued<https://twitter.com/selfissued>.

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