[Openid-specs-ab] IdP initiated login

Wed Nov 2 21:14:52 UTC 2011

Hi John -

The scenario that I'm talking about is where the user starts on IdP's site
in an authenticated state, and is presented with a list of links to
services hosted on other sites. The user clicks on one of the links and is
seamlessly logged into one of the services without having to
re-authenticate.

So for example, imagine that the user is an employee and is authenticated
into her work intranet portal. The portal has a link to check the user's
mail, which is hosted on a different domain. The user should be able to
click on the [check mail] link and be able to use the mail application
without having to authenticate again.

This is a pretty common use case - many companies outsource corporate
applications like mail, expense reports, calendaring, payroll, travel
bookings, etc  to 3rd parties.  The user logs into their employer's
corporate portal and should be able to click on the links to the different
apps, without having to re-authenticate.

Does OpenID Connect have a solution for this use case?

Allen

On Tue, Nov 1, 2011 at 7:11 AM, John Bradley <ve7jtb at ve7jtb.com> wrote:

> Yes but that, can't be done with the existing OAuth flow in connect.   The
> OAuth presumption is that the user is starting at the RP and the RP stores
> state about what IdP the user is going to.
>
> There is not enough info in the authentication response alone for the RP
> to figure out where it came from.
>
> We need an extension to OAuth that would start the flow from the IdP and
> send the extra info,  as well as protecting against XSRF.
>
> John
> On 2011-11-01, at 2:21 AM, Harald Petersilka wrote:
>
> Hi John,****
> ** **
> I was more thinking of a kind of dashboard located at an IdP where I can
> collect my OpenID sites and just have to click them to be logged in.****
> There I’d send the user to the RP with the already known OpenID as
> GET/POST parameter to initiate the common authentication procedure just
> without forcing the user to enter his OpenID every time.****
> ** **
> BG, Harry****
> ** **
> ** **
> *Von:* openid-specs-ab-bounces at lists.openid.net [mailto:
> openid-specs-ab-bounces at lists.openid.net] *Im Auftrag von *John Bradley
> *Gesendet:* Dienstag, 01. November 2011 01:32
> *An:* Allen Tom
> *Cc:* openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net
> *Betreff:* Re: [Openid-specs-ab] IdP initiated login****
> ** **
> I agree that the user needs to go back to the IdP.  ****
> ** **
> I was saying the first step of getting the user to the RP can't be OAuth,
> because it doesn't have enough info.****
> ** **
> I was thinking that the IdP would need to have the user full frame and
> present some sort of dialog before sending the request to the RP.****
> Otherwise the attacker XSRFs the IdP to get to the RP.****
> ** **
> You seem to have another use case where the attacker is cooperating with a
> bad IdP to log the user into a RP as some 4th party that the attacker
> controls?****
> ** **
> John****
> On 2011-10-31, at 9:22 PM, Allen Tom wrote:****
>
>
> ****
> Hi John -****
> ** **
> I think that there's still an XRSF vulnerability even if the the IdP shows
> a dialog before generating the assertion.****
> ** **
> The attacker could login to the IdP with the attacker's own account, then
> go through the flow to see the dialog. The attacker could then click
> through the dialog and capture the assertion (possibly using a browser
> extension, or modified client) and then send the assertion to a victim
> (possibly via IM or email) to have the victim be signed into the RP using
> the attacker's account.****
> ** **
> This is why the RP needs to bounce the browser back to the OP to have the
> OP verify that the assertion was issued to the same browser before sending
> the browser back to the RP.****
> ** **
> I used to think that Login XRSF was not a big deal (who cares if an
> attacker can get someone else to login as the attacker?) - however there
> are a few interesting scenarios where a victim could have their privacy
> compromised.****
> ** **
> Allen****
> ** **
> ** **
> ** **
> On Mon, Oct 31, 2011 at 5:10 PM, John Bradley <ve7jtb at ve7jtb.com> wrote:**
> **
> If the IdP is not presenting a dialog then it leaves the user open to
> XSRF. ****
> ** **
> In a code flow you only get code and state from the IdP it is the RP's
> responsibility to figure out where it came from, so that wouldn't work.***
> *
> If you used the Token flow the RP would need to look into the id_token to
> see where it came from.  ****
> That would be a problem for simple clients, because they need the
> introspection endpoint, and to get that they need to get the issuer from
> inside the token.****
> ** **
> I think we need a separate API that takes as its  parameters:****
>  issuer****
>  nonce****
>  hmac of issuer & nonce with client secret.****
> ** **
> That way the RP can tell that the IdP is sending the request and not a 3rd
> party.****
> ** **
> The RP would do a normal authentication with prompt=none to the issuer.***
> *
> ** **
> There is a extra hop.****
> ** **
> We need to identify & authenticate the issuer/IdP somehow in the first
> step.****
> ** **
> John B.****
> ** **
> ** **
> ** **
> On 2011-10-31, at 5:42 PM, Allen Tom wrote:****
>
>
> ****
> Hi John -****
> ** **
> Is this the Unsolicited Assertion use case - where the user clicks on
> a sponsored link hosted on the IdP's site and gets authenticated on the
> RP's site?****
> ** **
> I think we had discussed this at IIW a couple years ago, and the general
> consensus was that upon receiving an unsolicited positive assertion, the RP
> would need to redirect the user's browser back to the OP to have the OP
> re-generate the assertion and resend it back to the RP. ****
> ** **
> The downside is that the UX would suffer due to the extra round trip.****
> ** **
> Allen****
> ** **
> ** **
> ** **
> ** **
> On Mon, Oct 31, 2011 at 6:56 AM, John Bradley <ve7jtb at ve7jtb.com> wrote:**
> **
>
> Just a note on a possible idea.
>
> The when the RP registers a client ID it sets unsolicited_login_url:  to
> some return_url
>
> The IdP then sends the id_token with nonce set to  a time stamp + entropy
> , and a claim of idp_initiated: true .
>
> We probably need to restrict this to the code flow.
>
> RP could then check that the id_token was not generated by XSRF and set
> it's cookies.
>
> I don't see a general way that a unmodified RP is going to be able to
> safely.
>
> This should probably be an extension.
>
> John  B.
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> ** **
> ** **
> ** **
>
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