[OpenID] [SPAM]Re: [QUAR] Re: Independent study on OpenID awareness using Mechanical Turk

Tue Nov 18 16:19:58 UTC 2008

For one, I could not ultimately care less what __large__ OPs or do - tho the swing to "idp-centric" federations exercising their "control impulses" during this phase of "governance-driven growth" is quite predictable (as it was during the hierarchical PKI CA uptake, before self-signed certs came back nicely - even in foreground systems - as in a million enterprise routers, a hundred million home routers, countless millions of Microsoft domain controllers,...)

OpenID is not about large TTP companies, doing big company things - to own consumer user information in trust. If it becomes that, id agree with Paul (if he actually asserted this) that it is nothing other than a (relatively poorly) engineered "protocol equivalent" to SAML , addressing some of the same use cases as does SAML.

 If it stays its design course, it's part of the web2.5 UI-centric world, as in the UI for linkbacks; as in its URLness integrates with the other URL-centric "components" of the modern web GUI; as in its portability allows the user freedom to move lifestyle data around without any penalty or hinderance; as in its persistent-search properties integrate nicely with RDF ontologies and their next generation mashup UIs...

I'm guilty of equating openid with SAML. Im beginning to  see Ive been wrong.

Its more useful to equate OpenID Auth with SSL Record Layer. And that's a huge shift in paradigms. Folks building SSL record-layer plugins was always a pipe dream (which happened only in mega- large companies). OpenID allows __anyone__ to **easily** do this kind of crypto-based enhancement/invention, even after mass deployment and adoption. We just never had that...in the world of web1.0 SSL, once NSA/DoC killed off Microsoft's winsock provider implementation.

From: general-bounces at openid.net [mailto:general-bounces at openid.net] On Behalf Of Paul Madsen
Sent: Tuesday, November 18, 2008 7:29 AM
To: Chris Messina
Cc: Brynn Evans; Luke Sontag; OpenID user experience; Scott Kveton; OpenID List
Subject: [SPAM]Re: [OpenID] [QUAR] Re: Independent study on OpenID awareness using Mechanical Turk

Hi Chris, to clarify. I wasn't suggesting that OpenID should be 'invisible', just :

1) pointing out that SAML is (except in some rare cases)
2) large OPs appears to be heading in that direction
3) posing the question as to whether a user that is 'aware' of OpenID is better off  than another oblivious to the fact (I don't know the answer)

Thanks

Paul

Chris Messina wrote:
There have been subsequent responses that I thought were interesting and worth sharing:

http://connectid.blogspot.com/2008/11/naval-gazing_17.html

Paul suggests that the study amounts to "navel gazing" and that OpenID should be a background technology, like SAML, and users shouldn't have to become aware of it -- thus, this survey is asking the wrong question (i.e. who cares whether people identity or know what OpenID is?).

I talked about branding OpenID in one of my subsequent posts, so I won't rehash my thoughts on that here.

http://idlogger.wordpress.com/2008/11/17/statistical-entrails-reading/
Jeff Bohren follows up and suggests that the larger OpenID providers (here's lookin' at you, Yahoo and AOL) who have been up for awhile should be sharing statistics on use of their endpoints, *EVEN* if (as I suspect), adoption and usage are infinitesimally small, so that we can gauge uptake over time.

It would seem to me that this is work that the OIDF should be facilitating, and something that Brian Kissel, vis-a-vis the marketing team, should be working on.

What needs to happen to get the large (or even smaller) OPs to start providing data about use of accounts with OpenID? Maybe Brian Ellin could throw something up on AppEngine to aggregate these numbers?

Chris

On Sun, Nov 16, 2008 at 12:54 PM, Nat Sakimura <sakimura at gmail.com<mailto:sakimura at gmail.com>> wrote:
+100 !
On Sat, Nov 15, 2008 at 11:52 AM, Brian Kissel <bkissel at janrain.com<mailto:bkissel at janrain.com>> wrote:

Congrats Chris, well done!

Cheers,

Brian

==============

Brian Kissel

Cell: 503.866.4424

Fax: 503.296.5502

From: user-experience-bounces at openid.net<mailto:user-experience-bounces at openid.net> [mailto:user-experience-bounces at openid.net<mailto:user-experience-bounces at openid.net>] On Behalf Of Chris Messina
Sent: Friday, November 14, 2008 2:56 PM
To: OpenID List; diso-project; OpenID user experience
Cc: Brynn Evans; Luke Sontag; Scott Kveton
Subject: [QUAR] Re: Independent study on OpenID awareness using Mechanical Turk
Importance: Low

ZDNet picked up the study:

http://blogs.zdnet.com/community/?p=131

Chris

On Thu, Nov 13, 2008 at 5:50 PM, Chris Messina <chris.messina at gmail.com<mailto:chris.messina at gmail.com>> wrote:

Wanted to share the results of a study that Brynn Evans and I completed at the end of October:

http://tr.im/mturk_openid

It cost me about $6 to collect responses from 301 people on Mechanical Turk. I felt that it was important to look into a wider sample size than Yahoo's study which was composed of 9 female Yahoo members in their thirties. In particular, many people drew conclusions from that small sample size about OpenID's awareness that I felt were unfounded and decided to seek out an independent analysis of a larger data set.

The original source data is available here:

http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=pSGbbhtwI4kOhPusNx8Kycg

Thoughts welcomed,

Chris

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