[OpenID] Musing on FaceBook, OpenID and the next mountain to climb

Sat Aug 2 03:11:37 UTC 2008

A few facts:

Facebook Connect could have been built on top of OAuth.
Facebook did not participate in the Open Web Foundation launch - Dave Morin was involved as an individual.
Facebook has been talking about their desire to open and learn more about open specs for a year now, with nothing to show for it.
Facebook has been invited and engaged in conversations with the community with nothing but a waste of time to show for it.

---

The fact that on the same day they announce support for the OWF, they also announce a product that is ignoring all the work done by this very same community they claim to be supportive off, is to me, a mockery. I would be happy to be proven wrong but for a year now seen nothing to make me believe it.

EHL

From: general-bounces at openid.net [mailto:general-bounces at openid.net] On Behalf Of Dick Hardt
Sent: Friday, August 01, 2008 3:40 PM
To: Paul Trevithick
Cc: david at sixapart.com; OpenID
Subject: Re: [OpenID] Musing on FaceBook, OpenID and the next mountain to climb

Hi Paul

While Facebook  could take the silo approach, they are interested in seeing how open standards could be used. They participated in the Open Web Foundation launch and when I was at their office earlier this week, they expressed serious interest in OpenID. See my blog post (which had to be run by them as it was an NDA meeting).

http://identity20.com/?p=155

Given the state of OpenID tech right now, I do not think it could be used to solve what they wanted to solve in a way that would deliver the clean user experience they desired -- but I would be happily proved wrong! ( I do think they could have used OAuth though)

As I mention in my post, this is an opportunity for the community to work with Facebook.

Myself, I think the technology needs to be enhanced and evolved so that it has features that Facebook Connect does not have in addition to the existing features.

If the community just sits back and says that all the bits are there -- just use them -- then this community is no different from other SSO communities that have told the creators of OpenID that they were reinventing the wheel.

-- Dick

On 1-Aug-08, at 2:09 PM, Paul Trevithick wrote:

The problem is that this isn't a technical issue. FB currently has no business incentive to use open technologies that, among many other things, would allow users to be able to retrieve and store their own profile data and friends lists (as currently violates the FB TOS). They are still enjoying the virtuous cycle of the closed mega silos: more users begets more users. OTOH FB will open up if and when there's a reason to do so. But for now, and for a good while, I'd say FB isn't a good prospect for open, user-centric technologies.

Paul

On 8/1/08 3:28 PM, "Allen Tom" <atom at yahoo-inc.com> wrote:

David Recordon wrote:
> Is there really anything that Facebook did that couldn't be
> accomplished with OpenID Authentication 2.0 and OpenID Attribute
> Exchange?
Facebook Connect has a nice set of libraries/apis that RPs can just drop
in relatively easily on their site. The JS libraries implement much of
the sign in flow (displaying inline sign-in forms as well as a
permissions screen) which means that the FB Connect user experience is
consistent across all RPs.

They also seem to have implemented Single Sign Out, because signing out
of FB seems to also sign you out of the RP.

Additionally, FB Connect also authorizes the RP to write to the user's
FB News Feed, so there's an authorization component as well. The
authorization seems to expire when the browser session is closed, so
it's not quite like OAuth.

And finally, FB Connect requires that the RP pre-register with FB to get
an api key which presumably allows FB to authenticate the RP, and also
gives FB the ability block the RP if necessary.

Unlike the OpenID/OAuth/AX services currently in the wild, the FB
Connect stack is highly integrated, with built in privacy controls and a
standard UI. But as you correctly stated, I believe most, if not all, of
the stack could have been built upon open standards.

Allen

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