[Openid-specs-ab] Lite Draft 8

Breno de Medeiros breno at google.com
Thu Aug 18 21:41:48 UTC 2011

There's also a concern with HTTPs support (or lack thereof by some
clients). An id_token that is used as a session cookie and leaks
through an unprotected channel can presumably cause less damage than a
full access_token might.

Regardless of HTTPs support, it's usually a good idea to treat cookies
and API access tokens as different beasts for security reasons, and
the id_token is functionally a session cookie for the client.

On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 13:47, John Bradley <ve7jtb at ve7jtb.com> wrote:
> One of the early design decisions was to not mess with the access tokens people are currently using.
> I originally wanted to make the access token a JWT so that a single token could be used for both.
> The arguments against that were breaking existing API and a desire by people who do want to pass scope inside the token to separate the delegated access scopes from the session management info.
> They didn't want both in the same token.
> Changing to a single token effects session management and the rest of the specs, that is a huge change.
> John
> On 2011-08-18, at 3:46 PM, Johnny Bufu wrote:
>> On 11-08-16 04:31 PM, John Bradley wrote:
>>> The two tokens have potentially different scopes and lifetimes.
>>> There are good reasons for separating resource authorization from session authentication.
>> An OAuth token is, conceptually, an identifier for a grant that the server keeps in its database.
>> Rather than emitting two different tokens, the server could associate the two grants with a single token, and service it differently based on the endpoint the token is presented at:
>> - the sorter-lived, one-time use grant for the check session endpoint
>> - the longer-lived, multiple-use grant for the userinfo endpoint
>> This single token would be a short identifier, not a heavy(er) JWT, suitable for lite clients.
>> On 11-08-17 07:35 PM, John Bradley wrote:
>> > We did discuss using a JWT for the access token so that it could do
>> > double duty.
>> > Some people like Sales Force have existing code for there access tokens
>> > so they don't want to change that.
>> > Another issue is token size, making the session token carry all of the
>> > scope information for the user-info and other endpoints may make the
>> > token too large to be practical.
>> >
>> > It would also be more complicated for the RP to get right, than keeping
>> > the session and access grant tokens separate.
>> Full clients wanting a signed JWT for optimization could indicate this in the authorization request. There shouldn't be much of a problem for servers to use the JWT as an identifier / access token for the userinfo grant, but full-clients' life should be made easier by including an equivalent but shorter userinfo access token in the JWT payload.
>> Thoughts on this proposal? I'd like to find out if I missed anything that would prevent it from covering the use-cases I've seen brought up on the list recently.
>> Johnny


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