[Openid-specs-ab] A call for clarity.

Jeremie Miller jmiller at pingidentity.com
Wed May 5 17:40:52 UTC 2021

Tom, I understand and appreciate this perspective, and have very similar
concerns myself.

On the call yesterday I expressed concerns around the title of Oliver's
draft being "W3C Verifiable Credentials Objects" due to that strong
association, but I don't believe the actual protocol framework proposed in
the draft is specific to anything from the CCG, it just supports
encapsulation of it.  In fact, the repo is named "vp-token-spec" and the ID
name is "openid-connect-4-verifiable-presentations-00" which I think is a
much more appropriate label for the contents.

I am quite interested in having a simple presentation protocol that
leverages OIDC, and this is the best starting draft that I've seen yet.


On Wed, May 5, 2021 at 9:38 AM Tom Jones via Openid-specs-ab <
openid-specs-ab at lists.openid.net> wrote:

> This is a call to avoid dragging the muddle from verifiable credentials
> into OpenID specs. The works of the W3C ccg have deliberately conflated all
> of the actors in an identity ecosystem under the impression that such a
> muddle will create something called "herd privacy". They have deliberately
> chosen to be anarchic and amoral principles under a misguided idea that if
> they avoid clear labels for things, then they will be "in compliance" with
> the GDPR. This is wrong-headed. It is only by the actions of strong legal
> and standards organizations that human beings can assert their rights
> against governments and corporations.
> I tried to reread the VC spec to see if I could draw some clarity from it,
> but it just became increasingly clear that the point of that spec was not
> clarity, but deliberate confusion. The mixing of attributes and claims is
> complete, no line can be drawn between them. The mixing of credential and
> presentations is complete. The very idea that a birth certificate is a
> collection of claims is flat wrong. It is a legal assertion of a binding.
> I want to take a strong stand for clarity and against the adoption of the
> CCG muddle presented by Oliver's draft. It is a bad way to start a
> standards process.
> ..tom jones
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